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PostPosted: Sat Feb 06, 2010 8:56 pm 
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If I may be permitted a linguistic observation on this issue:

The unconvincing insistence on Allah being some sort of "moon god" or "moon-goddess" (in the related thread) masks a much more unacceptable and obvious truth — unacceptable for the Zionist authorities and their stooge churches, that is.

Throughout the Old Testament, the Hebrew word for "God" is elohiym. This word is actually a plural form meaning "gods", even though it has been translated as "God" (singular) in all subsequent Greek and Latin Bibles. So the word (mis)translated as "God" in the Old Testament of the Bible is, in fact, Hebrew eloh + the standard Hebrew plural ending -iym.

Hebrew eloh is clearly and demonstrably the same word as Arabic allah. The only difference in usage between the two is that the Hebrew OT Bible always has the plural and the Koran always the singular (as does the New Testament).

In other words the Hebrew Old Testament always speaks of "gods" and the Koran always speaks of "God". It is the Hebrew OT that is clearly polytheistic, giving this away by using "gods" throughout, while the Koran just uses "God" in the singular (as does the New Testament).

There's a good example of this mistranslation issue at Gen 3:5 where the same Hebrew word elohiym is translated as "God"and "gods" in the same verse:

Gen 3:5 For God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil.

Clearly the correct translation would be to have both as "gods" - but there isn't a Bible translator brave enough to do this.

This truth is unacceptable because it reveals the gulf between a polytheistic Old Testament on the one hand, and a monotheistic New Testament and Koran on the other - a far cry from the false notion of "Judeo-Christianity" vs. Islam so avidly pushed by our official Churches, Governments and Media.


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 06, 2010 9:26 pm 
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Thanks for bringing that up, hapax. You did a good job of making that clear. Acharya discusses it in a few places such as Christ Conspiracy, page 90 for starters.

And, welcome to the party.

I should add that there's nothing about what you said that is mutually exclusive to the point of this thread. I don't think it is unconvincing at all that Allah is a moon god. In fact, I think that point is not only convincing but well proved. If the word "allah" is an Arabized form of "eloh," the god developed by the Muslims in the Koran by that name still could be a lunar god or lunar aspect of "God," aka elohim. In fact, I'm sure he is, based on all the evidence, including the very convincing material already posted here.

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PostPosted: Sun Feb 07, 2010 12:09 am 
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That is interesting, but I am not sure why Ah-yah being a moon god is not convincing. All the clues are there.

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Nonviolence is the greatest force at the disposal of mankind. It is mightier than the mightiest weapon of destruction devised by the ingenuity of man. ~ Gandhi

Non-violence leads to the highest ethics, which is the goal of all evolution. Until we stop harming all other living beings, we are still savages. ~ Thomas A. Edison


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PostPosted: Sun Feb 07, 2010 6:44 am 
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We still need further investigation before assessing Islam true origin.

Check out also this thread:
ISLAM: the Kaaba mirrors the al-Baytu l-Maʿmur constellation

Also, the holy black stone at Mecca is clearly symbolic of female genitalia (a common symbol for all earth goddesses and mirrored by the Virgo/Isis/Mary constellation, representing the "virgin soil"):

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 02, 2010 6:59 pm 
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Mrs.Acharya ,i was glad to join your forum .but now i am shocked when reading and watching those videos that are full of Fabrication , twested ideas .You put aheavy burden on my shoulders.beacuse i have to defend Islam ,my religion ,that i am proud of ,but in another language ,not my native Arabic.i can understand english wellwhen i read it , but i don't have this wealth of fluid language of yours ,to express the amount of information i know and the right words to clear my point of view. i wish ALLAH would help me ,and put the right words in my mouth>
It makes me feel very sad to see all these attaks on Islam here in your forum , without any moslem available to defend .i'll do my best to explain to you -with evidence -what was not clear or misunderstood , unless you were not a truth seeker. forgive me for my frankness .cause i noticed that the no one here is giving evidence of what he claims .
As a beginning ,i'd like to tell you that this man "Ayotollah Khomini" follows a cult called 'shiaa' .Shia claim they are muslim ? Please visit this site,which will proof they are not ? Listen and whatch what they say and practice.
-----------------------------
These two websites contain many information about Shi'ites and their beliefs
etc.. Anybody who has those beliefs is clearly a Kaafir.

http://www.geocities.com/CollegePark...8909/clip.html

http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Part...7089/shia.html
The picture , in the forum ,of a man kissing a boy in his mouth ,is the picture of a shia man .we use it to unvail the reality of them.
About the quotes from the quran you presented on this link http://www.truthbeknown.com/islamquotes.htm
i got shocked with the following:
Mohammed promised his followers seven heavens in which:

They are to cohabit with demure virgins...as beauteous as corals and rubies...full-breasted maidens for playmates...in the gardens of delight.... They're to lie face to face on jewelled couches, and be serviced by immortal youths...young boys, their personal property, as comely as virgin pearls.... We created the houris [dancing girls] and made them virgins, carnal playmates for those on the right hand.... We are going to wed them to dark-eyed houris. [The Koran 55:56; 55:58; 78:33; 56:12; 52:16-17, 24; 56:35-38; 52:20]

Each Muslim man, in exchange for a lifetime of mindless obedience, was to be rewarded after death with an unspecified number of pretty boys to bugger, plus eight heavenly houris, each more phallus-raising than the others and each endowed with the capacity to grow a new hymen after each bout of sexual recreation. The male chauvinist Muslim could thus satisfy his virginity fetish by deflowering them over and over again, for eternity. When one compares Mohammed's gardens of delight with the Christian heaven of harps and celibacy, it becomes apparent why significant numbers of Christian men turn Muslim while conversions the other way are almost non-existent.


William Harwood, Mythology's Last Gods: Yahweh and Jesus, 248
these are sever lies . and i assure you that if this was true ,i would have never been a moslem for a second.


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 02, 2010 7:20 pm 
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All about the black stone
As for the Black Stone, we touch or kiss it in order to honor us with association with the great Prophet (peace and blessings be upon him). We don’t exaggerate in our love for it. We do kiss it because our Prophet (peace and blessings be upon him) did so.

Responding to your question, Sheikh Ahmad Kutty, a senior lecturer and Islamic scholar at the Islamic Institute of Toronto, Ontario, Canada, says:

There are various reports from the Prophet (peace and blessings be upon him) concerning the origin of the Black Stone, but most of them are of doubtful origins. In Islam, we should not base our belief on sources which we cannot verify one hundred percent. The only fact that we can certainly establish is that it was put there by Prophet Ibrahim and Isma’eel (peace be upon them both) by the order of Almighty Allah, and the purpose of it was to indicate the beginning of tawaf (Circumambulation of the Ka`bah).

Thus we as Muslims do not attach divine power to the stone. As `Umar ibn Al-Khattab (may Allah be pleased with him) is reported to have said: “You are just a stone that does not benefit or harm anyone, and if I had not seen the Prophet (peace and blessings be upon him) kissing you, I would have not done so."

So, we are simply touching or kissing the Black Stone in order to honor us with association with the great Prophet (peace and blessings be upon him); it does not imply any reverence whatsoever.

Moreover, some other scholars have classified some of the hadiths concerning the Black Stone as sahih (authentic) and as such they relate some importance to the Black Stone. The prominent Saudi scholar Sheikh MuhammadSalih Al-Munajjid quotes some of those hadiths:

1. Ibn `Abbas (may Allah be pleased with him) reported that the Prophet (peace and blessings be upon him) said: “The Black Stone came down from Jannah (Paradise).” (At-Tirmidhi)

2. Ibn `Abbas (may Allah be pleased with him) also narrated that the Prophet (peace and blessings be upon him) said: “When the Black Stone came down from Paradise, it was whiter than milk, but the sins of the sons of Adam made it black.” (At-Tirmidhi)

3. Ibn `Abbas (may Allah be pleased with him) further related that the Prophet (peace and blessings be upon him) said: “By Allah, Allah will bring it forth on the Day of Judgment, and it will have two eyes with which it will see and a tongue with which it will speak, and it will testify in favor of those who touched it in sincerity.” (At-Tirmidhi)

4. Ibn `Umar (may Allah be pleased with him) quoted the Prophet (peace and blessings be upon him) as saying: “Touching them both [the Black Stone and Ar-Rukn Al-Yamani] is an expiation for one’s sins.” (At-Tirmidhi)
Muhammad is credited with playing a key part in the history of the Black Stone. In 602, before the first of his prophetic revelations, he was present in Mecca during the rebuilding of the Kaaba. The Black Stone had been temporarily removed while a new structure was being constructed. A story found in Ibn Ishaq's Sirah Rasul Allah (as reconstructed and translated by Guillaume) shows Muhammad settling a quarrel between Makkan clans as to which clan should set the Black Stone in place. His solution was to have all the clan elders raise the cornerstone on a cloak, and then Muhammad set the Stone into its final place with his own hands.[6][9][10]
because of the historical importanse of the black stone some tribes stall it .during the fight it broke into pieces ,they had to collect it and fix it ,but it became very wake so they covered ti with that shield ,as seen in the picture ,with a hall in the middle to let people see it inside .we do not worship the black stone> we worship ALLAH. so it is not as claimed ,the stone is like the body of a women .this idea comes only from a sick mind.


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PostPosted: Wed Mar 03, 2010 2:26 am 
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It's all still purely tribal thinking and superstition.

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Nonviolence is the greatest force at the disposal of mankind. It is mightier than the mightiest weapon of destruction devised by the ingenuity of man. ~ Gandhi

Non-violence leads to the highest ethics, which is the goal of all evolution. Until we stop harming all other living beings, we are still savages. ~ Thomas A. Edison


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PostPosted: Wed Mar 03, 2010 3:35 pm 
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Thor

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if you want to know the real Terrorist .look at these picture.
in the following link

Code:
http://gofolk.com/forum/#topic/--2010-01-02.htm


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PostPosted: Wed Mar 03, 2010 8:29 pm 
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So now you are blaming the Jews? How quaint. You know this finger pointing has gone on for years. The Xians say they aren't terrorists, yet their history to this day is filled with violence. The Muslims blame the Xians and Jews. The Jews... well, I think the Holocaust speaks for itself and because of that, they said never again. So back and forth you all go, yet Muslims destroyed Buddhists statues for a stupid superstitious reason. What did the Buddhist ever do any Western religion? Oh yes. Graven Images. I'm surprised the Xians didn't beat you to it. Oh wait! They did in South America, but they didn't think to do it to Buddhist icons or IF they did, they it wasn't known around the world.

Not to mention, Muslims treat women worse than Xians ever did. Xians didn't make women, except nuns, wear gunny sacks and completely destroy any self-esteem they might have had. At least nuns can show their faces- none of them wear a peep hole or just expose one eye, never have. Sorry, but it seems to me Muslim men are cavemen who think with their penises, instead of the gray matter in their skulls. It is primitive and barbaric for men to think they can just rape a woman, esp one who isn't wearing a sack. Of course, Xian thinking is primitive and barbaric too, so you all don't hold a corner on barbarism and primitive thoughts. The Jews, well some of them are just as bad, esp the Orthodox ones.

I have yet to hear of any Buddhist starting any religious wars in recent years, but the Western religions... well we are having one right now. Have been for several years now and to me, it is just plain stupid. No Jesus or Mohammad is going to descend from the clouds. What will descend from the clouds is NUKE! There is your god- for ALL the Western religions.

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Nonviolence is the greatest force at the disposal of mankind. It is mightier than the mightiest weapon of destruction devised by the ingenuity of man. ~ Gandhi

Non-violence leads to the highest ethics, which is the goal of all evolution. Until we stop harming all other living beings, we are still savages. ~ Thomas A. Edison


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PostPosted: Wed Mar 03, 2010 8:59 pm 
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Quote:
beacuse i have to defend Islam ,my religion ,that i am proud of

Why do you feel the need to defend Islam? Why is it "your" religion? Why would you be proud of a male-dominated cult that subjugates women and that declares war on non-Muslims?

You can be free of this spiritual, emotional, psychological enslavement that has been foisted upon you, likely since birth. It is not "your" religion. It is someone else's religion that has been forced upon you. Islam is a desert warrior - and, yes, LUNAR - cult that has been compelled upon entire cultures at the point of a sword. It is absolutely NOT something to be proud of.

Keep reading here, and you will find the truth, but not so long as you believe that this manmade desert cult is "your" religion and that it is something to be proud of. You need not defend this cult. If you free yourself, you can actually learn about the world and live with other people in friendship. So long as you are a cultist, however, you will be isolated in spirit and thought from the bulk of humanity - and you will be a threat to freedom in defending this cult of death and enslavement.

Here is the truth about Islam - is this really something to be proud of?

The religion of peace

Islam is absolutely the worst thing that has ever happened to women. You, as a "Moslem lady," really need to find your way to freedom.

Women's Rights in Islam

Here are some examples of courageous women who have freed themselves from the enslavement of Islam:

Ayaan Hirsi Ali
Dr. Wafa Sultan

Follow their lead!

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 03, 2010 9:07 pm 
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Quote:
i got shocked with the following:
Mohammed promised his followers seven heavens in which:

They are to cohabit with demure virgins...as beauteous as corals and rubies...full-breasted maidens for playmates...in the gardens of delight.... They're to lie face to face on jewelled couches, and be serviced by immortal youths...young boys, their personal property, as comely as virgin pearls.... We created the houris [dancing girls] and made them virgins, carnal playmates for those on the right hand.... We are going to wed them to dark-eyed houris. [The Koran 55:56; 55:58; 78:33; 56:12; 52:16-17, 24; 56:35-38; 52:20]

Each Muslim man, in exchange for a lifetime of mindless obedience, was to be rewarded after death with an unspecified number of pretty boys to bugger, plus eight heavenly houris, each more phallus-raising than the others and each endowed with the capacity to grow a new hymen after each bout of sexual recreation. The male chauvinist Muslim could thus satisfy his virginity fetish by deflowering them over and over again, for eternity. When one compares Mohammed's gardens of delight with the Christian heaven of harps and celibacy, it becomes apparent why significant numbers of Christian men turn Muslim while conversions the other way are almost non-existent.

William Harwood, Mythology's Last Gods: Yahweh and Jesus, 248
these are sever lies . and i assure you that if this was true ,i would have never been a moslem for a second.

You should be shocked because, no, these remarks are absolutely not "sever lies." They are true - I think you have been sheltered and have not really studied even the Koran. The Koran is repeatedly referenced in that quote, so how can these claims be "lies" when they certainly ARE in the Koran.

Yes, you should be shocked - profoundly shocked to your core. Not by Harwood's commentary - which is factual - but by the Koran itself and the history of Islam.

Quote:
and i assure you that if this was true ,i would have never been a moslem for a second

Well, it is true, so what are you waiting for?

And as concerns the whole Shia versus Sunni debate, Sunni is little better. Do you know that some 23% of all Saudi children have been raped? And that's just the ones that have been reported.

Do you understand Arabic? Here is a video about this atrocity, about which I would wager you have never heard a thing. Hence, don't be so sure you know all about Islam.


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 04, 2010 7:10 pm 
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Mrs acharya ,i understand your feelings well. what you were told about islam is frightening .but ,for example,you do not know my kids more than i do= you don't know islam more than i do. i was born a moslem .when i was 20 , i knew a little about islam.i had many doubts and many question . accordingly, i started reading and searching for answers,and i found all the answers . they were satisfying to me . Mrs. achyarya i respect you . i joined your forum because i read your essay about Mary and Isis .you were so accurate . you joined your words with clear evidence . so i ask you and insist ,to read and criticize islam . but first you should depend on trusted authenticated sources . such as:
http://www.islam-guide.com/

the following link is to download the authenticated translation of quran
http://www.megaupload.com/?d=96QWKQ00

who is mohammad?
http://mohammad.islamway.com/?lang=eng


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 06, 2010 3:21 pm 
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Quote:
"i joined your forum because i read your essay about Mary and Isis .you were so accurate"

She is equally accurate about Islam too. Don't let selective perception and biases stand in the way of the facts and evidence that actually exist. Faith & euphoria does not trump reality.

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 06, 2010 7:25 pm 
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Dear Muslim Lady,

I understand your gripe about the western versions of the Koran. If any westerner of non middle-eastern descent can do the Koran justice it will be Thomas Cleary. I have never seen Acharya misrepresent Islam, which I believe is, like other faiths, generally presumptious, and I agree with her that it is repressively patriarchal. At the same time I believe that the U.S. const. and the D.O.I. are also repressively patriarchal and cannot help noticing a double standard from many westerners. Acharya has also pointed out that a great deal of modern Islamic law is based on the law of Moses.


As it stands now there is a lot of propaganda on both sides, the middle eastern provocateurs give their Korana verses in Mohammed’s time and how they see it applied to today’s world, and the western world, so subtly influenced by the Christian prejudices, particularly of Islam, take there setting up of a “Global Jihad” on face value, and do little to learn the time of Mohammed, his earliest bios.

In my readings of the Koran I have never seen any such phrase as Global Jihad., also the Apostasy charge seems read into the Koran as I have noticed no instance of Mohammed ordering the killing of “non-believers”.
From here these westerners most often cite random verses from the Koran which, as the translations currently stand, appear to be shocking and of a violent nature. But how many westerners have taken the time to read the Koran in full? Those that have should notice that the frequency of such statements, specifically a call to violence or killing, appear more in the mouth of Jesus then they do Mohammed and with a lot less frequency then in the Koran, especially if we are to mistakenly group the OT with the NT as a single work as many often due. Also noted is that similar speech was used in secular literature. No one could argue that Jesus, Buddha, or Mohammed were greater promoters of killing then Moses, and if we are to believe that Moses’ law was strictly enforced, certainly he, or the result of his myth, would rank as one of the greatest killers.
As a matter of fact only a few religious heroes have been known to never preach of violence or “killing”. Many would be surprised to find out that Krishna killed, or that Buddha said he was a killer and that the followers of both figures had murderers walking freely among them (both have an account of their master killing someone causing them to go to heaven??). It is true we are told that Mohammed led military campaigns but also noted is that Jesus tells his listeners to sell everything and buy swords and his other calls to violence (Luke 19:27). With Mohammed he did not instigate military campaigns and there is good evidences suggesting that his retreat to Mecca, or “The City”, was a defensive move. Also speaking of his character is that we are told that he was wounded in battle.

All of these figures must be weighed in their own times; Krishna Jesus and Mohammed lived in harsher times then Buddha. Sometime they may have used the word “killed” metaphorically as we do today such is the case with the Korana phrasing of “your violence” meaning one anger inside. Certainly no one could say that any of the previously mentioned figures were random murderers. But today Mohammed is considered to be a mere figure that killed in the name of God. The schools systems do little to confront this Christian fueled inconsistency as they erroneously believe that Western or Eastern culture can be taught without thoroughly teaching World religion.


Regarding the “Pagan” in “Pagan Moon God” some translations from the Koran state that “Pagans” should be killed (through war) if they fail to practice charity and offer prayers. Although I take into account its conventional use, personally I believe that the blanket grouping of “Pagan” is somewhat the result of Christianities age old censorships and this lumping together of many belief systems is also a categorization accepted by many non-Christians. Usually their reasoning is the gods vs. God argument, but in Genesis God is either talking to himself or to the other gods (elohim), and what are the angels but “gods”? Also we are told that Jesus’ God is three-in-one and Jesus speaks of the female wisdom goddess. Furthermore, although the moon was sacred in many cultures, the moon worship out of Arabia may have been related to the moon Sabbath that the figure of Isaiah was against. There is secondary evidence supporting that pre-Mohammedan Allah was associated with the moon, but this being the case we should also call Jesus' God “The God who is pleased to see his son die". Besides the Koran offers countless attributes and metaphors describing Allah and for this reason it would not be totally accurate to call the Muslim God ‘The Moon God’


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 06, 2010 9:14 pm 
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Which is more violent, the Bible or the Quran?

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Christ in Egypt: The Horus-Jesus Connection
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