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PostPosted: Fri Nov 09, 2012 8:34 pm 
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Where is the evidence for astrotheology in the bible?

I just wanted to get this thread out there to get started on it. I wanted to go through both the Old Testament and the New listing astrotheological connections in timeline order as much as possible. I may add this to the FAQ.

Celebration dates offer some astrotheological correspondences too:

Christmas / Epiphany

Easter

St. John's Day - summer solstice

The Assumption of Mary Aug 15

All Saints Day Fall peak

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PostPosted: Sat Nov 10, 2012 8:23 am 
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Astrotheology in the Bible

Thank you FTL for starting this discussion. Your suggestion of a timeline is good, but it is worth also clarifying some issues regarding how the Bible treats astral themes.

The problem of assessing the astral content in the Bible is that the surface text contains a strong denial of any association between the supernatural symbolism of God and the natural world. God is portrayed as beyond the universe, transcending time and space, eternal and infinite, and yet present in the world in the incarnation of Jesus Christ and in relation to the people of Israel. The Second Commandment at Exodus 20 forbids idolatry, which was generally interpreted to mean a rejection of astrotheology. And the real Ten Commandments, Exodus 34:13ff, say the first commandment is “tear down their altars and break their pillars and cut down their Asherim.” Asherah (the Queen of Heaven – associated with Isis and Venus) was the wife of Jehovah, but it seems the divorce got a bit messy after Jehovah changed his name from El (the planet Saturn) and transcended the universe. So even where the Bible discusses the zodiac almost explicitly, as in Job 38:32 “Canst thou bring forth Mazzaroth in his season?” the point is that God is guiding the stars, not revealed in them.

The Bible presents any worship of nature as incorrect, as a theological error to be condemned by the patriarchal prophetic politics. So there are numerous derogatory mentions of astrotheology. Furthermore, some verses that on the surface are astral have been censored in many modern translations, such as the mention of the “King of Ages” in Revelation 15, and the mention of Jupiter and Saturn at Amos 5:26, both of which are deleted from prominent versions such as the New International Version.

To get a sense of how fundamentalists deal with these problems, it is worth reading an entertaining tract at http://askelm.com/temple/t000901.htm which provides a fine piece of typical apologetic rubbish. This tract, titled Lingering Idolatry in the Temple of God begins with the observation that “even God Himself recognized that some of those commands that He gave to the Israelites were NOT GOOD — they turned out to be commands that led Israel into full-scale idolatry”, as explained at Ezekiel 20:25.

These ‘bad’ divine instructions turn out to be all the astrotheological ones. Even though Ezekiel opens up his book of prophecy with veiled explanation of how astronomical prediction is the model of prophecy, with the cosmic symbols of the four living creatures and wheels within wheels, he goes on with violent language aganst reverence for anything natural.

Old Zeke got so annoyed because of what our fundy author calls “the nascent proclivity for the early Israelites to rebel against the basic commands of God that He intended for their good. It seemed to be in their very nature to want to be idolaters.” Remember how Aaron went along with the golden calf? There’s more. Just five chapters after the Ten Commandments we get the idolatry of the Ark of the Covenant “make two cherubim of gold, of beaten work shall you make them, in the two ends of the mercy seat.” Amos later would explain in 5:25 that God is unhappy because the Jews worship Jupiter and Saturn, with a tabernacle that may link to the ark of the covenant, with the cherubim as symbols of the outer planets with their 12 and 30 year cycles. So this rampant prophetic iconoclasm aimed to root out all naturalism to justify the alienated patriarchal orthodoxy, along the lines of King Josiah’s fraudulent ‘discovery’ (invention) of Deuteronomy with its condemnation of worship of the sun, moon and stars at 4:19.

Another piece of astrotheology is the snake on the pole: God ordered Moses to make an image of a snake and to hang it on a pole that the Israelites could look toward for a physical remedy in the wake of being bitten by poisonous snakes.” (Numbers 21:6–8) This snake on a pole bears suspicious resemblance to Aion, the precessional God of time in Mithraism, suggesting the intrusion of esoteric astral themes into early Judaism prefiguring the cross of Christ, as mentioned at John 3:14, leading in to the most famous verse in the whole Bible.

No wonder the prophets got so agitated about idolatry. The Cherubim and the snake/image became so idolatrous to the Israelites, that in the time of Hezekiah the snake/image had to be destroyed because of the rampant idolatry that it provoked (2 Kings 18:4).

Despite all this anti-astralism, Judaism was grounded in astral symbolism, as Josephus explains in his description of the high priest’s breastplate as a zodiac image and the curtain of the temple (the one that was supposedly rent in twain from top to bottom) as an image of the visible universe. So, it seems that Biblical redaction had a careful eye for the exclusion of astral themes, but the writers were in conflict with their society, who revered the natural cosmos.

The destruction of sources leaves us with the problem of reconstructing the original texts that would have reflected astral religion. It is highly plausible that many texts originated from astral sources and were amended to conceal their origin. Jesus as the sun is the most obvious example, but there are many more, especially based on observation of precession of the equinoxes as providing the structure of time. If we read the Bible against the premise that it is encoding astral themes, everything from the seven days of creation through to the tree of life and the holy city appear to be parables for natural cosmic observation.


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PostPosted: Sat Nov 10, 2012 11:55 am 
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Thanks for clarifying all that, Robert. It needed to be said so, it's perfect to have at the start. I knew this would be tedious and time consuming but just wanted to get started since it seems like a worthy project that could be quite useful. The many points you mention make it categorically clear how important and badly needed such a thread as this really is. It will certainly be of good use.

I figured that the question and title of this thread: "Where is the evidence for astrotheology in the bible?," would be a good project to separate out all the non-biblical Paganism connections and just focus on all the astrotheological references throughout the bible itself. It's probably wise to do that with other holy texts as well. Hopefully, it will be an obstacle for all those who'd rather just immediately toss out the typical hand-waving dismissals. It's far more difficult to dismiss when it's right there in their preferred holy book. At least, that's my point with this thread.

It's probably wise to point out all the hatred for nature too since it all just begs the question of where all this hatred for nature is coming from and why.

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PostPosted: Sat Nov 10, 2012 3:26 pm 
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There are plenty of book clubs out there, perhaps it's a good idea to start our own (sarcasm) beginning with Genesis Chapter 1 Revised Standard Version (RSV) in search of all the astrotheological connections from within the bible itself. Lets go through chapter by chapter. I'm just searching for words like: light, stars, sun, moon etc. and other related terms like "Mazzaroth" from Job 38:32, which basically means zodiac.

This would be an epic effort to say the least but, I fear not because Acharya S and others have already performed this task for us. We really need to check the original Hebrew as even the RSV makes an error in Genesis 1 with "God" instead of "Gods" in the plural as it is in the original Hebrew.

I've created a Creation Myths thread to address the below. I thought we already had one:

Quote:
1 In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.
2 The earth was without form and void, and darkness was upon the face of the deep; and the Spirit of God was moving over the face of the waters.
3 And God said, "Let there be light"; and there was light.

snip

Quote:
14 And God said, "Let there be lights in the firmament of the heavens to separate the day from the night; and let them be for signs and for seasons and for days and years"

"Signs"??? as in zodiac signs?

Okay, wow, really cooking here, all the way up to Genesis 14 already, phew, I'm exhausted. :lol:

All we really need to do here is go through Acharya's Christ Conspiracy to pluck out much of the astrotheology in the bible. I'll start on that when I get back ....

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2013 Astrotheology Calendar
The Mythicist Position
Christ in Egypt: The Horus-Jesus Connection
Stellar House Publishing at Youtube


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 11, 2012 9:33 am 
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Well if some background on who wrote the bible and why is needed going into it, we always have Karen Armstrong and Israel Finkelstein for reference. The evolution of God and monotheism is a key point to have on the table going into it. Plus, Finkelstein's The Bible Unearthed plainly lays out quotes about ancient Israel's star worship. When coming from the perspective of archaeology outlining astrotheology things seem much clearer. Example:



That puts Genesis through to all of the prophets into perspective and makes understandable the people wanting star worship and the leaders trying to weed it out as time went on. From that perspective, then turning to Genesis 1 it all makes much better sense.

There's no wiggle room left for trying to use negative astrotheological passages to conclude that no astrotheology existed in the Bible, or that it's ridiculous to even suggest it as some detractors attempt. In perspective Genesis 1 is entirely influenced by Babylonian contact. And there's a continual struggle between the people wanting to keep the astrotheology and the leaders wanting to curb it for political reasons. But nevertheless the astrotheology was built right into the very structure of ancient Judaism as attested by Philo and Josephus. So it makes sense to outline the struggle between politics and nature religion which led right into the first century with the Gnostic movement flourishing and spreading out of Judaism and becoming Christianity....

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The "Jesus Christ" of the New Testament is a fictional composite of characters, real and mythical. A composite of multiple "people" is no one.

The celestial Origins of Religious Belief
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Jesus: Hebrew Human or Mythical Messiah?


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 01, 2013 11:08 am 
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Are you guys still thinking about doing this? I currently am reading through "The Harper Collins Study Bible" and Tanakh for a religion class and this would give me something productive :lol: to do while I do so!


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 01, 2013 11:39 am 
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Welcome to the party, AdNoctem!

It turns out that much of this had already been done by Acharya here: Jesus as the Sun throughout History

Here's more:

Astrotheology of the Ancients

Origin of All Religious Worship

The Astrotheological Origins of Christianity

Why I am A Mythicist

What is a Mythicist?

Evemerist vs. Mythicist Position

Were George Washington and Thomas Jefferson Jesus Mythicists?

Astrotheology / Case for Mythicism 101 Course

The Mythicist Challenge Petition [Draft]

List of 180+ mythicists

A Mythicist Timeline

The Mythicist Position


Jesus as the Sun God?


I would like to see the creation of our own Department of Astrotheological and Mythological Studies.

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2013 Astrotheology Calendar
The Mythicist Position
Christ in Egypt: The Horus-Jesus Connection
Stellar House Publishing at Youtube


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